Seriously - DO NOT try to come to BKK or Pattaya now. Go to Phuket. It'll still be a blast - Jimbo will take good care of you for sure and you'll have less travel headaches. I'll be more than surprised if anything resembling normal travel is restored before mid-December at the earliest. With the King's Birthday coming up on Friday, no one will get in or out of BKK (except the few U-Tapao can handle) for quite awhile. Unless the PAD pulls a surprise move to honor the King somehow, no one's going anywhere....
What the hell is going on?
Started by
waltz
, Nov 24 2008 02:19 AM
34 replies to this topic
#27
deuce
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Posted 02 December 2008 - 02:04 AM
Seriously - DO NOT try to come to BKK or Pattaya now. Go to Phuket. It'll still be a blast - Jimbo will take good care of you for sure and you'll have less travel headaches. I'll be more than surprised if anything resembling normal travel is restored before mid-December at the earliest. With the King's Birthday coming up on Friday, no one will get in or out of BKK (except the few U-Tapao can handle) for quite awhile. Unless the PAD pulls a surprise move to honor the King somehow, no one's going anywhere....
yep.. here i am still in patts.. after who knows how many months!.. i cant beleive some of you guys are thinkin about comin in!
although youd never know it here in patts where its just another -albeit a bit more quiet than usual- monday night/tuesday morning.. im glad im not in bkk. who knows how im gonna get out next month.. damn sure thai airways better pay for my vip bus to utapao or something... damned if im doin ten hours from here to chiang mai to get a flight.
yes- unless i can catch a bit of bbc or news asia or bloody australia network ( ahh the boring taste of home) on my cable in the room.. or be bothered to watch the thai channels which are covering it non stop. its hard to actually get any updates. any BMs stuck here or due to be stuck here in patts?
the wisest man that ever was, when asked what he knew... replied that the one thing he did know was that he knew nothing
#28
jimbo34
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Posted 02 December 2008 - 01:18 PM
This is all looking pretty awful. If the Courts rule today that this government is illegal and must be dissolved, the red shirts will take to the streets instead of the yellow ones! Thailand is in a no-win situation right now.
If you're due to come to Thailand in the next 10 days, i would think again, unless you're flying direct to Phuket. I hear Utupao is absolute chaos - its only a potty little airport and cant possibly handle more than a few dozen people at a time, not the hundreds that are gathered outside in the car park hoping to get a stand-by ticket! It must be hell.
I will try to update on the Court's decision, and its implications tonight.
If you're due to come to Thailand in the next 10 days, i would think again, unless you're flying direct to Phuket. I hear Utupao is absolute chaos - its only a potty little airport and cant possibly handle more than a few dozen people at a time, not the hundreds that are gathered outside in the car park hoping to get a stand-by ticket! It must be hell.
I will try to update on the Court's decision, and its implications tonight.
#29
Rossco
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Posted 02 December 2008 - 02:34 PM
Friends arrived in Thailand 10 days ago. They had a brief stay on one of the islands and then came to Pattaya. They had a pre booked flight from U Tapao (Pattaya) to Phuket - Bangkok Air.
They admitted that U Tapao was chaotic BUT their flight left on time and they had a smooth trip to Phuket. If their flight out of Thailand is delayed then they will return to Pattaya until a flight becomes available.
Of course there is disruption but it will end - eventually. Most protests are passive but common sense dictates avoid any centre of unrest.
If you are not in Thailand already I would advise checking with your agent and airline before commencing a journey here. If you do travel it will be "Up to You" if you get stranded upon arrival - you chose to travel knowing the possible problems. Check what redress you have on travel insurance, PRIOR to travelling, if you were to become stranded.
If you are an employee of a company your company may not be so tolerant about a delayed return if you knowingly travelled to Thailand knowing the possible travel situation.
In the meantime we have seen no demonstrations in Pattaya and in fact life is as normal. Golf and LB's.
The King is to make a speech on the 4th prior to his birthday on the 5th - perhaps he will be the calming influence on the dissident population.
They admitted that U Tapao was chaotic BUT their flight left on time and they had a smooth trip to Phuket. If their flight out of Thailand is delayed then they will return to Pattaya until a flight becomes available.
Of course there is disruption but it will end - eventually. Most protests are passive but common sense dictates avoid any centre of unrest.
If you are not in Thailand already I would advise checking with your agent and airline before commencing a journey here. If you do travel it will be "Up to You" if you get stranded upon arrival - you chose to travel knowing the possible problems. Check what redress you have on travel insurance, PRIOR to travelling, if you were to become stranded.
If you are an employee of a company your company may not be so tolerant about a delayed return if you knowingly travelled to Thailand knowing the possible travel situation.
In the meantime we have seen no demonstrations in Pattaya and in fact life is as normal. Golf and LB's.
The King is to make a speech on the 4th prior to his birthday on the 5th - perhaps he will be the calming influence on the dissident population.
#30
gaz
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Posted 02 December 2008 - 04:01 PM
Thailand slips further into chaos as court dissolves government.
Thailand's government has been disbanded and the Prime Minister barred from politics for five years in a court ruling that has prompted fears of a slide into civil war.
The Constitution Court was widely expected to find the government guilty of electoral fraud and order its dissolution, but its ruling has renewed fears of violence and caused some to question whether the country has a functioning government any more.
Hours before the court hearing a grenade was fired from a flyover near the domestic airport hours, killing one anti-government protester and wounding 22 people.
The Prime Minister, Somchai Wongsawat, will now step down, along with 36 other executives from his People Power Party, achieving a key goal of royalist demonstrators who have blockaded the capital’s two airports for the past week.
'My duty is over. I am now an ordinary citizen, ‘ Mr Somchai, 61, said in the northern city of Chiang Mai from where he has been governing since the airport blockade began.
The judgment could set the stage for the protesters to end their week-long airports siege. Earlier today, cargo flights resumed from the main international hub.
The ruling came as hundreds of red-shirted pro-government supporters demonstrated noisily outside the court. They have already declared the ruling against the (PPP) as a 'coup in disguise';.
But the decision was greeted with delight by the militant People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) who have been trying to topple Mr Somchai's government for months. They have occupied Government House since August as well as the airports in a last ditch bid to topple Mr Somchai, whom they accuse of being a pawn for his brother-in-law, former premier Thaksin Shinawatra.
Mr Thaksin was ousted in a 2006 coup and is now in exile after being convicted of corruption.
‘My heart is happy. My friends are very happy,’ said Pailin Jampapong, a 41-year-old Bangkok housekeeper choking back tears as she jumped up and down.
Nattawut Sai-kau, a government spokesman, said Mr Somchai and his six-party coalition would step down.
‘We will abide by the law. The coalition parties will meet together to plan for its next move soon,’ he said.
However, fears of violent clashes, or worse, are growing. ‘It now seems that violence cannot be avoided. Some even predict what has been unthinkable for 700 years: a civil war,’ the Bangkok Post said in an editorial. It added: ‘Does Thailand have a functioning government?’
The ruling on allegations of vote fraud in the December 2007 election will not necessarily mean a snap election as many PPP MPs will simply switch to a new ‘shell’ party already set up.
The electoral fraud case was scheduled to be heard at the Constitutional Courthouse in Bangkok on Tuesday, but authorities moved it after hundreds of red-shirted government supporters surrounded the building.
The PAD blockade of the airports has stranded hundreds of thousands of tourists in Thailand, devastating the country's tourist industry and threatening its fragile economy.
The government confirmed today it would postpone the ASEAN summit of Asian leaders, due to take place in Thailand in mid December.
http://www.timesonli...icle5271710.ece
Thailand's government has been disbanded and the Prime Minister barred from politics for five years in a court ruling that has prompted fears of a slide into civil war.
The Constitution Court was widely expected to find the government guilty of electoral fraud and order its dissolution, but its ruling has renewed fears of violence and caused some to question whether the country has a functioning government any more.
Hours before the court hearing a grenade was fired from a flyover near the domestic airport hours, killing one anti-government protester and wounding 22 people.
The Prime Minister, Somchai Wongsawat, will now step down, along with 36 other executives from his People Power Party, achieving a key goal of royalist demonstrators who have blockaded the capital’s two airports for the past week.
'My duty is over. I am now an ordinary citizen, ‘ Mr Somchai, 61, said in the northern city of Chiang Mai from where he has been governing since the airport blockade began.
The judgment could set the stage for the protesters to end their week-long airports siege. Earlier today, cargo flights resumed from the main international hub.
The ruling came as hundreds of red-shirted pro-government supporters demonstrated noisily outside the court. They have already declared the ruling against the (PPP) as a 'coup in disguise';.
But the decision was greeted with delight by the militant People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) who have been trying to topple Mr Somchai's government for months. They have occupied Government House since August as well as the airports in a last ditch bid to topple Mr Somchai, whom they accuse of being a pawn for his brother-in-law, former premier Thaksin Shinawatra.
Mr Thaksin was ousted in a 2006 coup and is now in exile after being convicted of corruption.
‘My heart is happy. My friends are very happy,’ said Pailin Jampapong, a 41-year-old Bangkok housekeeper choking back tears as she jumped up and down.
Nattawut Sai-kau, a government spokesman, said Mr Somchai and his six-party coalition would step down.
‘We will abide by the law. The coalition parties will meet together to plan for its next move soon,’ he said.
However, fears of violent clashes, or worse, are growing. ‘It now seems that violence cannot be avoided. Some even predict what has been unthinkable for 700 years: a civil war,’ the Bangkok Post said in an editorial. It added: ‘Does Thailand have a functioning government?’
The ruling on allegations of vote fraud in the December 2007 election will not necessarily mean a snap election as many PPP MPs will simply switch to a new ‘shell’ party already set up.
The electoral fraud case was scheduled to be heard at the Constitutional Courthouse in Bangkok on Tuesday, but authorities moved it after hundreds of red-shirted government supporters surrounded the building.
The PAD blockade of the airports has stranded hundreds of thousands of tourists in Thailand, devastating the country's tourist industry and threatening its fragile economy.
The government confirmed today it would postpone the ASEAN summit of Asian leaders, due to take place in Thailand in mid December.
http://www.timesonli...icle5271710.ece
#31
gaz
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Posted 02 December 2008 - 04:03 PM
Court ruling brings down Thai government
BANGKOK, Thailand (AP) — A court dissolved Thailand's top three ruling parties for electoral fraud Tuesday and temporarily banned the prime minister from politics, bringing down a government that has faced months of strident protests seeking its ouster.
The Constitutional Court ruling set the stage for thousands of protesters to end their weeklong siege of the country's two main airports, but also raised fears of retaliatory violence by a pro-government group that could sink the country deeper into crisis and cripple its economy.
Members of the People's Alliance for Democracy, occupying Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi international airport, cheered and hugged after they heard news of the verdict.
"My heart is happy. My friends are very happy," said Pailin Jampapong, a 41-year-old Bangkok housekeeper choking back tears as she jumped up and down.
Government spokesman Nattawut Sai-kau said Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat and his six-party ruling coalition would step down.
"We will abide by the law. The coalition parties will meet together to plan for its next move soon," he told The Associated Press.
He also said the government was postponing a regional summit in Thailand of Southeast Asian countries, from December to March.
Somchai had become increasingly isolated in recent weeks. Neither the army, a key player in Thai politics, nor the country's much revered king had offered him firm backing. Since Wednesday, he and his Cabinet had been working out of the northern city of Chiang Mai, a government stronghold.
Somchai accepted the ruling with equanimity.
"It is not a problem. I was not working for myself. Now I will be a full-time citizen," he told reporters in Chiang Mai.
Somchai's People's Power Party, the Machima Thipatai party and the Chart Thai party were found guilty of committing fraud in the December 2007 elections that brought the coalition to power with a thumping majority.
Court President Chat Chalavorn said the court was dissolving the parties "to set a political standard and an example."
"Dishonest political parties undermine Thailand's democratic system," he said in the court's ruling.
The ruling sends Somchai and 59 executives of the three parties into political exile, barring them from politics for five years. Of the 59 members, 24 are lawmakers who will also have to resign their parliament seats.
But other lawmakers that escaped the ban can join other parties and try to cobble together a new coalition and choose a new prime minister.
Until then, Deputy Prime Minister Chaowarat Chandeerakul will become the caretaker prime minister, said Suparak Nakboonnam, a government spokeswoman. She said parliament will have to pick a new prime minister within 30 days.
Despite the appearance of a smooth political transition, the ruling is expected to widen the dangerous rift in Thai society that many fear could lead to violence between pro- and anti-government groups.
Hundreds of Somchai's supporters gathered outside the court to express their anger, saying the swiftness of the ruling — the closing arguments ended earlier Tuesday — reeked of predetermination. At one point they cut off the power supply to the court, but electricity was restored with diesel generators.
"The court is not qualified to make this ruling. They are nothing more than apologists for the alliance, who are ruining the country," said a speaker, shouting through a megaphone.
Late Monday, an explosive device fired from an elevated highway fell among hundreds of protesters inside Don Muang airport, killing one person and wounding 22.
It was the third such attack in two days by unidentified assailants targeting the protesters. So far, seven people have been killed and scores injured in bomb attacks, clashes with police and street battles between government opponents and supporters.
Despite the ruling, the protest alliance told its members to stay put at Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang domestic airports for now.
Top leaders of the alliance would meet later Tuesday to decide the next course of action, said Sirichai Maingam, an alliance leader.
Up to 10,000 alliance members have taken over the two airports, cutting off all commercial traffic to the capital, stranding more than 300,000 foreign travelers and bleeding millions of dollars from the country's economy in lost business and tourism.
At Suvarnabhumi airport, the verdict was read out on a protest stage outside the main terminal, triggering cheers and loud roars of jubilation.
It is "good for Thailand. This is a blow for corruption," Nong Sugrawut, a 55-year-old businessman at Suvarnabhumi.
With Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang closed, stranded travelers are being flown out of provincial airports with limited passenger capacity or are making their way overland to neighboring Malaysia.
Even if the protesters disperse, officials say it will take at least another week before the airports become operational again.
Standard & Poor's revised the credit rating outlook for Bangkok Bank, the country's biggest, from stable to negative. It issued similar downgrades for seven other major enterprises and for Thailand in general.
The protesters accuse Somchai of being a proxy of ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the alliance's original target. Thaksin, who is Somchai's brother-in-law, was deposed in a 2006 military coup and has fled the country to escape corruption charges.
Chokchuang Chutinapon, a 64-year-old retired medical doctor from Bangkok, said the verdict "is wonderful for PAD."
"It is a victory for the entire nation, a victory over the corrupt and dictatorial Thaksin regime and ... Somchai who is the puppet of Mr. Thaksin," he said.
Alliance supporters are largely middle-class citizens who say Thailand's electoral system is susceptible to vote-buying and argue that the rural majority — the Thaksin camp's political base — is not sophisticated enough to cast ballots responsibly.
They have proposed discarding direct elections in favor of appointing most legislators, fostering resentment among rural voters.
http://www.google.co...EVZyFQD94QEG5O0
BANGKOK, Thailand (AP) — A court dissolved Thailand's top three ruling parties for electoral fraud Tuesday and temporarily banned the prime minister from politics, bringing down a government that has faced months of strident protests seeking its ouster.
The Constitutional Court ruling set the stage for thousands of protesters to end their weeklong siege of the country's two main airports, but also raised fears of retaliatory violence by a pro-government group that could sink the country deeper into crisis and cripple its economy.
Members of the People's Alliance for Democracy, occupying Bangkok's Suvarnabhumi international airport, cheered and hugged after they heard news of the verdict.
"My heart is happy. My friends are very happy," said Pailin Jampapong, a 41-year-old Bangkok housekeeper choking back tears as she jumped up and down.
Government spokesman Nattawut Sai-kau said Prime Minister Somchai Wongsawat and his six-party ruling coalition would step down.
"We will abide by the law. The coalition parties will meet together to plan for its next move soon," he told The Associated Press.
He also said the government was postponing a regional summit in Thailand of Southeast Asian countries, from December to March.
Somchai had become increasingly isolated in recent weeks. Neither the army, a key player in Thai politics, nor the country's much revered king had offered him firm backing. Since Wednesday, he and his Cabinet had been working out of the northern city of Chiang Mai, a government stronghold.
Somchai accepted the ruling with equanimity.
"It is not a problem. I was not working for myself. Now I will be a full-time citizen," he told reporters in Chiang Mai.
Somchai's People's Power Party, the Machima Thipatai party and the Chart Thai party were found guilty of committing fraud in the December 2007 elections that brought the coalition to power with a thumping majority.
Court President Chat Chalavorn said the court was dissolving the parties "to set a political standard and an example."
"Dishonest political parties undermine Thailand's democratic system," he said in the court's ruling.
The ruling sends Somchai and 59 executives of the three parties into political exile, barring them from politics for five years. Of the 59 members, 24 are lawmakers who will also have to resign their parliament seats.
But other lawmakers that escaped the ban can join other parties and try to cobble together a new coalition and choose a new prime minister.
Until then, Deputy Prime Minister Chaowarat Chandeerakul will become the caretaker prime minister, said Suparak Nakboonnam, a government spokeswoman. She said parliament will have to pick a new prime minister within 30 days.
Despite the appearance of a smooth political transition, the ruling is expected to widen the dangerous rift in Thai society that many fear could lead to violence between pro- and anti-government groups.
Hundreds of Somchai's supporters gathered outside the court to express their anger, saying the swiftness of the ruling — the closing arguments ended earlier Tuesday — reeked of predetermination. At one point they cut off the power supply to the court, but electricity was restored with diesel generators.
"The court is not qualified to make this ruling. They are nothing more than apologists for the alliance, who are ruining the country," said a speaker, shouting through a megaphone.
Late Monday, an explosive device fired from an elevated highway fell among hundreds of protesters inside Don Muang airport, killing one person and wounding 22.
It was the third such attack in two days by unidentified assailants targeting the protesters. So far, seven people have been killed and scores injured in bomb attacks, clashes with police and street battles between government opponents and supporters.
Despite the ruling, the protest alliance told its members to stay put at Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang domestic airports for now.
Top leaders of the alliance would meet later Tuesday to decide the next course of action, said Sirichai Maingam, an alliance leader.
Up to 10,000 alliance members have taken over the two airports, cutting off all commercial traffic to the capital, stranding more than 300,000 foreign travelers and bleeding millions of dollars from the country's economy in lost business and tourism.
At Suvarnabhumi airport, the verdict was read out on a protest stage outside the main terminal, triggering cheers and loud roars of jubilation.
It is "good for Thailand. This is a blow for corruption," Nong Sugrawut, a 55-year-old businessman at Suvarnabhumi.
With Suvarnabhumi and Don Muang closed, stranded travelers are being flown out of provincial airports with limited passenger capacity or are making their way overland to neighboring Malaysia.
Even if the protesters disperse, officials say it will take at least another week before the airports become operational again.
Standard & Poor's revised the credit rating outlook for Bangkok Bank, the country's biggest, from stable to negative. It issued similar downgrades for seven other major enterprises and for Thailand in general.
The protesters accuse Somchai of being a proxy of ousted Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the alliance's original target. Thaksin, who is Somchai's brother-in-law, was deposed in a 2006 military coup and has fled the country to escape corruption charges.
Chokchuang Chutinapon, a 64-year-old retired medical doctor from Bangkok, said the verdict "is wonderful for PAD."
"It is a victory for the entire nation, a victory over the corrupt and dictatorial Thaksin regime and ... Somchai who is the puppet of Mr. Thaksin," he said.
Alliance supporters are largely middle-class citizens who say Thailand's electoral system is susceptible to vote-buying and argue that the rural majority — the Thaksin camp's political base — is not sophisticated enough to cast ballots responsibly.
They have proposed discarding direct elections in favor of appointing most legislators, fostering resentment among rural voters.
http://www.google.co...EVZyFQD94QEG5O0
#32
Rossco
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Posted 03 December 2008 - 10:23 PM
I do wish Gaz would stop "Copy/Paste" news items that can be read through a link - my opinion.
Western style democracy really only works in a society that is well informed (of all opinions/stances) and well educated.
Look back in the history of Western society - at one time Labour Unions dominated/ruled the leftist parties.
A Western election has some interesting major topics on which each party pins it hopes:
Defence
Taxes
Health - national medicine (See Michael Moore's movie "Sicko" for a slant on the US)
Pensions/job security
Education
These are always the top 5 issues fought over in a Western economy election - USA, Australia, Europe.
Now read the list again and relate those issues to Thailand - NONE apply.
So to understand Thai politics needs a total re think outside the Western point of view. Even as a resident I am unsure of the issues that relate to Thai politics.
I have heard many people speak of the "bribes" offered to Thai's at Polling stations. Yes it is true that many uneducated/illiterate Thais will vote for a 100 baht note.
Now relate that to the amount spent (per capita) by Obama in the US election. Marketing, advertising and Air Time are all also bribes - just once removed from cash.
Western style democracy really only works in a society that is well informed (of all opinions/stances) and well educated.
Look back in the history of Western society - at one time Labour Unions dominated/ruled the leftist parties.
A Western election has some interesting major topics on which each party pins it hopes:
Defence
Taxes
Health - national medicine (See Michael Moore's movie "Sicko" for a slant on the US)
Pensions/job security
Education
These are always the top 5 issues fought over in a Western economy election - USA, Australia, Europe.
Now read the list again and relate those issues to Thailand - NONE apply.
So to understand Thai politics needs a total re think outside the Western point of view. Even as a resident I am unsure of the issues that relate to Thai politics.
I have heard many people speak of the "bribes" offered to Thai's at Polling stations. Yes it is true that many uneducated/illiterate Thais will vote for a 100 baht note.
Now relate that to the amount spent (per capita) by Obama in the US election. Marketing, advertising and Air Time are all also bribes - just once removed from cash.
#33
Guest_pentire_*
Guest_pentire_*
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Posted 03 December 2008 - 10:33 PM
I do wish Gaz would stop "Copy/Paste" news items that can be read through a link - my opinion.
He is trying to elevate his status by appearing to be an intellectual poster
#34
matchman
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Posted 03 December 2008 - 11:51 PM
I do wish Gaz would stop "Copy/Paste" news items that can be read through a link - my opinion.
He is trying to elevate his status by appearing to be an intellectual poster
Damm he's going to need alot of posts!
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