2252 replies to this topic

[bkklover]

[quote]franck, i´m totally with you here. I don´t like when the lb´s we love and travel across he world for are being referred to as hookers. On the other board Moo was called "average hooker with herself to blame (the bust for yaba)". I don´t see any reason to degrade them like this, sure they are working girls, but why slag them like that? Maybe its just me and where i come from, prostitution is considered bad here and to call someone hooker is a direct insult. Maybe not in LOS, i´m still learning.....
Call me naive and soft travelling to Thailand and paying for fun, but don´t like to call thing by its real or worst name....but thats me.

I see some comments and threads about the girls, not so much here, but the other board, where guys talk about them like pieces of meat, 2nd grade humans or a merchandise.
I got slagged for trying to help Moo, what kind of heartless assholes do that?
It makes me sick and honestly makes me consider shut the hell up here, go on with my new found favourite hobby all by myself and not post trip reports or information about the "meat" we discuss here. Theres a few good guys here, you know who you are.....

Phew...
Laters guys...[/quote][/quote]


So what do you call a person who sells his or her body for money?

These are working girls who make their living fucking guys for money. lets all pretend then that they actually like us and they are sleeping with us because they actually like us and we dont pay them, just make a donation to their living expenses.

Unfortunately for Moo, she got caught, and franck has done a sterling job, but do you think she or any ladyboy would help if the rolls were reversed.

Come on Rickard, lets get real.

[mardhi]

[quote][quote][quote name="franck, when I post the above's "statement" to let you guys know a well deserved image of a nice girl, being or not a prostitute.

When I saw some replies, for a while I thought that I "enter" on onother website ... :roll:

If she was fucked or not for one million guys it isn't my concern.

Sometimes trying to write nice and fair things I have bad answers, so, it is better to be quiet for a while ...[/quote]


franck, i´m totally with you here. I don´t like when the lb´s we love and travel across he world for are being referred to as hookers. On the other board Moo was called "average hooker with herself to blame (the bust for yaba)". I don´t see any reason to degrade them like this, sure they are working girls, but why slag them like that? Maybe its just me and where i come from, prostitution is considered bad here and to call someone hooker is a direct insult. Maybe not in LOS, i´m still learning.....
Call me naive and soft travelling to Thailand and paying for fun, but don´t like to call thing by its real or worst name....but thats me.

I see some comments and threads about the girls, not so much here, but the other board, where guys talk about them like pieces of meat, 2nd grade humans or a merchandise.
I got slagged for trying to help Moo, what kind of heartless assholes do that?
It makes me sick and honestly makes me consider shut the hell up here, go on with my new found favourite hobby all by myself and not post trip reports or information about the "meat" we discuss here. Theres a few good guys here, you know who you are.....

Phew...
Laters guys...[/quote]


Well that was me that made that comment Rickard and considering the addendum I made, I stand by it. You might want to believe that these girls are angels who are totally hard done by and thats your call. However the reality is that many are not. I dont know Moo, other than seeing her in JSB, however lets not get removed from the reality of what she did that led to her getting jailed. She herself probably considers it a 'risk' she was prepared to take, in the same way that she rides a motorbike without a crash helmet and trusts in Budha to look after her.

Why bring Western standards to a country that has no western law system? Its totally hyperthetical - lets face it the average LB has been screwing around since about age 10-12 with Thai guys. Again the fact may not be nice to accept, but thats reality. I know Franke and agree he is a kind and considerate guy, however the average LB is NOT an angel. Why do you think the police look down on them so much - sometimes in Thailand, you have to respect the opinions of people who perhaps may know a lot more than you do and I dont mean other farangs, but the Thai's assessing Thais. This is nothing to do with evaluating "one person" but as a general statement. We all have experiences of good and bad encounters - but lets not kid ourselves that they are all perfect - this is a discussion board that should be talking openly about the reality of the LB situation. Frank is endevouring to find a good team of staff - he is probably discounting as many as he is hiring and so he should. He is probably well aware of drug use, STD's etc and is mindful who he is hiring - but dont forget, this aint an even playing field. Knowledge and shared experiences are key. The day this or any other forum attempts to mask that, is going to be a very sad day. Incidentally I dont see any attempt by anyone on this or other sites from a moderating standpoint to lessen the inherant dangers and risks - but as we say, to be warned is to be smart of what can go on. If it makes a farang visitor think twice about getting involved with someone a) who takes drugs & B) might get caught up in a sting operation - then that can only be a good thing in my mind.

Personally I have no issue with what this "Balou" has posted if it only makes people think "well maybe it aint a bed of roses going with a LB in Thailand" .

Cheers
Mardhi

[sev7en]

[quote="bkklover but do you think she or any ladyboy would help if the rolls were reversed.

quote]
Yes i do, and there was even a thread recently about how a falang lost him money and some lb let him stay with her gave him food etc.
So yes, i think they are as good as anyone helping a fellow human being.

[sev7en]

[quote][quote="mardhi

Well that was me that made that comment Rickard and considering the addendum I made, I stand by it. You might want to believe that these girls are angels who are totally hard done by and thats your call. [/quote][/quote]
mardhi, i just took one of the comments made about Moo, don´t mean to single you out.

And i listen to guys like you and the other experienced travelers here trying to learn the way of life in Thailand the do´s and dont´s. I now they are no angels or choirboys but that doesn´t mean i have to call them names or treat them like dirt? I chose to hang out with them and trying to make the best of that and that means treat them the way i would like to be treated.
mardhi, do you think guys here and the other forum talk about the lb´s in an ok way?

[koykaeng]

Franck,

I think I've given you pretty good advice in the time we have known each other, so remember one thing;

You can please some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

Cheers
Koykaeng

[kliome]

I hope Franck comes back but learns from this. I quite like the man and have enjoyed his company several times. I just think he has worn his heart on his sleeve and lost touch with realityt, perhaps gone a bit sex mad - but it's all understandable.

He's starting to remind me of Cornel Kurtz lost in the jungle, gone crazy with power. Maybe we need to send a man in to pull him out.

Not wishing to keep the thing about Moo going, but I was overwhlemed by Frnakcs generosity in helping her out of a hellish situation, but then completely underwhlemed when Franck kept joking about recieving his payment in sexual favours, and mixing in chat of a lustfull/sexual nature.

He's a good man at heart, and I know he's had hardship and been through some terrible events in his life, but sometimes I worry about whether he really understands what he's doing. He's doing what a lot of people have thought about doing, but have thuoght it through and decided to take the more moral/safe/sane option. I start to go a bit crazy after a couple of months in LOS.

I hope things work out for him, but I also hope he takes a more sensitive and professional approach, and for the sake of himself and others frequenting the bar, I think he should keep his private conquests and feelings more private. If not we're going to have to send a man in and pullhim the hell out of the jungle.

[Rossco]

Guys - up until now I have kept quiet. Having seen many sensible responses I am motivated to state a few facts:

Franck is a good guy with a good heart but his intentions get muddled. The boundaries between Reality and Fantasy and Business and Pleasure need to be established.

Noon' history has now been openly discussed - Why? Because Franck posted unnecesary emotive statments. So now we all know that she was working under age - where she worked and for how long and with whom she has been. Really useful to know - NOT

Using terms like "daughters" is well misplaced. I hope to god that no man would have his daughters working in that way!

LB's work for a living and we enjoy that fact BUT that is their job and they do it for money.
There are many LB's out there who are good people - in the industry or outside of it.
Yes they have feelings but they are in the oldest profession in the world. It is a hard profession and actually illegal here. Fact.

Franck's diary has become a bit personal - I really do not need, nor want, to know who his staff have been with, what they did, and how long it took. I also think recent photos are taking away from the illusion and not promoting it.

Real world is that Franck provides a venue to meet some very pleasant LB's. Business is business.
Fantasy is the inner dialogue on a personal level - too much and too intimate. Should be avoided.

Staff - I would like to know who are salaried vs freelance.
You can only claim "staff" as those that you employ and as an employer should check for STD certificates and ensure they all get tested.

Freelancers are those that visit the establishment, with the owners consent, to find customers and provide rotating variety.

Franck - come on publish and be damned. I would like to see the diary revert to:

List of Staff - and Freelancers
Staff profiles
Changes to staff
Events - planned and report on those that have taken place
Visits from Forum members - who has been in.

Remove the personal and the intimate - that is for individual Field/Trip reports. The diary has served a usful purpose but now has evolved into something too intimate for what is basically a Bar report. This development has now reaped the wind it always would - there is a break point for everthing.

Finally - Moo - yes I am pleased people helped BUT we also need to respect the principles of others. For a Farang to bring Drugs into LOS - the penalty is Death by firing squad - so if anyone wants to discuss the drugs issue please do knowing that simple fact - DRUG = DEATH.

[Ric007]

Rossco,

I totally agree with you and am glad you took your time to write it all down. I have also kept quiet since the whole diary became a personal issue involving feelings etc.

I do however respect Franck for his work but as you mention, business is business.

Franck, the beginning of the thread was good, then all these personal feelings started to come up and the whole thing just escalated from there. Try to keep things more on the business side, promoting your great venue and beautiful "staff/freelancers"

I would also like to see the points Rossco mentions at the bottom of his post.

Franck, hang in there and lets get this going again. Looking forward to hearing/reading from you soon again.

Cheers,
Ric

[Phil Lander]

I have been reading the forum for a few days and not posted as I have felt that some of the girls have been a bit over exposed making me look for other less well known ones . I really like this Forum so I hope this is not the start of slide down hill.

I really like Francks Diary as it gives me a feel for the place but it could be toned down a little bit . Maybe Franck saying he treats the girls like daughters has been lost in translation so we are misunderstanding what he means. :?

I intend to meet with Franck when I make it over as he given me a base to centre my holiday from and seems a genuine friend to travellers . I wish him well but perhaps he should'nt reveal so much emotionally.

[sev7en]

Poor franck

[franck]

Poor franck

Yes ... pity poor Franck